[CinCV TNG] Audio VST plugins

Sam cinelerra at posteo.de
Wed May 9 17:43:23 CEST 2018


Hi Haldun,

Very interesting. Thanks for the info.

Sam

On 09.05.2018 17:14, Haldun ALTAN wrote:
>
> Hello Sam,
>
> There is also a project named blendervelvets who does uses blender and 
> ardour initiated by a Bresilian cineaste.
>
> Haldun
>
> http://blendervelvets.org/blender-velvets-updated-for-blender-2-79/
>
>
> Le 09/05/2018 à 16:32, Sam a écrit :
>>
>> I'm just collecting some information on this topic so I won't forget 
>> it, so I'm writing this mail.
>>
>> I discovered a video that shows quite well how Blender 3d and Ardour 
>> are connected via the JACK Audio Server. Blender is also used by many 
>> people as video editing software. In this case, the audio workstation 
>> is outsourced to Ardour. It has the charming advantage that we only 
>> have to create this interface once. The many external audio plugins 
>> can be integrated into Ardour.
>>
>> It would have the following advantages for us:
>>
>> - The maintenance of plugins would be simplified, because Ardour can 
>> handle it excellently.
>> - Concentration on the core function of Cinelerra, video editing.
>> - Less work with the numerous audio plugins on Update.
>> - Cinelerra can't cover the range of possibilities in the audio 
>> field, Ardour is miles ahead. This would open up completely new 
>> possibilities for sound recording and mastering.
>> - With this feature Cinelerra would confirm the professional approach 
>> in the open source world.
>>
>> https://youtu.be/L_-9srfRuWg
>>
>> Sam
>>
>> On 09.05.2018 10:08, Sam wrote:
>>>
>>> I noticed the following with the new Calf plugins. The parameter 
>>> windows of the Calf plugins are not resizable. I always have scroll 
>>> bars in the window. However, the size of the FFmpeg windows can be 
>>> changed. It would be great if the new Calf Plugin windows could be 
>>> resized as desired. Thx.
>>>
>>> Sam
>>>
>>> On 08.05.2018 20:41, Sam wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for the explanation. I think Cinelerra will gain even more 
>>>> popularity. Cinelerra has not had the best reputation in the past, 
>>>> but the constant improvements have finally made it better known 
>>>> that it is making a seriously positive development. Maybe this will 
>>>> lead to some developers in the future. Especially when the new, 
>>>> more modern user interface is ready. The new user interface looks 
>>>> really good. Unfortunately it takes much longer than planned, 
>>>> because there are extremely many pictures.
>>>>
>>>> I wouldn't develop a rudimentary GUI, that takes a lot of time 
>>>> again. I might have a better suggestion. Especially for LV2 I would 
>>>> create an interface to Jack Audio Server. This means to forward the 
>>>> audio output from Cinelerra to Jack. I think that would work 
>>>> already, because in the audio settings there is the option to send 
>>>> the audio output to OSS. The Jack server can pick up this output 
>>>> and forward it to the Calf plugins. By Calf Plugin I mean the 
>>>> external Calf Jack Host. I can forward a Cinelerra audio track to 
>>>> the external Calf plugin and listen to it. Change it with this 
>>>> external calf plugin. As far as I have seen this external Calf 
>>>> plugin saves the values as XML file even with the correct name of 
>>>> the respective Calf plugin, for example Calf Compressor plugin. The 
>>>> Cinelerra Calf plugin could pick up these values. I don't know if 
>>>> it would even be possible to directly synchronize the Cinelerra 
>>>> Calf plugins with the external Calf plugins via the Jack Audio 
>>>> Server. I would recommend creating an interface to Jack in the 
>>>> future anyway. This gives us undreamt-of new opportunities in the 
>>>> future. We could probably even connect Ardour about it. As an 
>>>> example, each Cinelerra audio channel could optionally be opened as 
>>>> a midi channel to the Jack server. This solution would have the 
>>>> advantage to connect the plugins only with the external programs, 
>>>> thus no own GUI's have to be programmed for the plugins. The Calf 
>>>> Jack Host GUI looks absolutely great.
>>>> I hope I'm not talking nonsense.
>>>>
>>>> With the tool Cadence you even get a graphical setting possibility 
>>>> of the Jack Server.
>>>>
>>>> Here are a few links:
>>>> Jack - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JACK_Audio_Connection_Kit
>>>> Jack - Homepage: http://jackaudio.org
>>>> Jack - API: http://jackaudio.org/api/
>>>> Cadence for Jack: http://kxstudio.linuxaudio.org/Applications:Cadence
>>>> Sam
>>>>
>>>> On 08.05.2018 15:56, Good Guy wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>     but I can only enter the values manually, without the
>>>>>     graphical calf interface.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hey... if you can find any documentation or instructions on how 
>>>>> that works...
>>>>> you will be the first one.  The only reason I got this to work was 
>>>>> an interface
>>>>> I found in the ffmpeg filters.  That was the documentation.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is the issue.   The graphical user interface (gui) is 
>>>>> separate from cin5.
>>>>> It is a program that has its own system of operation.  It turns 
>>>>> out that the
>>>>> "controls" are a simple enough to communicate, but those programs are
>>>>> not designed to interface and operate the controls for another 
>>>>> external
>>>>> application program interface (api).
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree that these guis are great apis. I would like it a lot.
>>>>> I may be able to hot wire one, but probably only one if I am lucky.
>>>>> Especially without documentation, this would be very difficult.
>>>>>
>>>>> I can add a simpler gui interface.  I was thinking of adding an 
>>>>> "add/del"
>>>>> button that could add sliders or pots for the selected control.  
>>>>> That way
>>>>> the gui would not eat up the display, and would only contain the 
>>>>> controls
>>>>> that you intend to operate.  It would not be glitzy, just operational.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ever since I started working on this, I have been hoping that 
>>>>> developers
>>>>> interested in these programs would contribute to the work.  It is 
>>>>> a lot of fun,
>>>>> but there definitely is a limit to what I can do in the time frame 
>>>>> available.
>>>>> The ffmpeg filters are a good example.  There are about 100 ffmpeg 
>>>>> plugins
>>>>> that are disabled, because the interface won't initialize.  Fixing 
>>>>> these would
>>>>> be a piece of cake for the developer, but a nightmare for me.
>>>>>
>>>>> gg
>>>>> PS.  the code documentation in these programs is sphinx and doxygen.
>>>>> These more or less just restate the comments in the code. A great 
>>>>> quote
>>>>> from my past is: "the comments are what they wish it would do".
>>>>> In this case, the code is better documentation.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, May 8, 2018 at 1:06 AM Sam <cinelerra at posteo.de 
>>>>> <mailto:cinelerra at posteo.de>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>     First of all many thanks for the implementation of the LV2,
>>>>>     really great work!
>>>>>
>>>>>     The RPM Calf installation worked. All Calf plugins are displayed.
>>>>>
>>>>>     I can put the calf plugins on the audio track, but I can only
>>>>>     enter the values manually, without the graphical calf
>>>>>     interface. Is it possible to start the Calf interface?
>>>>>     Especially the well-designed Calf Studio interface makes
>>>>>     working much easier. Some of these new plugins are useless
>>>>>     without a graphical interface.
>>>>>
>>>>>     For comparison I can use Calf Jack Host to display the
>>>>>     plugins, but it is intended for direct midi music production.
>>>>>     I added a video showing how to start the Calf plugins through
>>>>>     Jack and the difference in using the plugin. It would be great
>>>>>     if I could start the Calf interface and it would synchronize
>>>>>     the values.
>>>>>     https://streamable.com/haukx
>>>>>
>>>>>     Sam
>>>>>
>>>>>     On 08.05.2018 03:19, Phyllis Smith wrote:
>>>>>>     Some of the information on Calf Studio is a little sketchy. 
>>>>>>     GG brought up Leap 42.3 and got it working by installing:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     http://packman.links2linux.org/download/calf/2956339/calf-0.0.60-4.7.x86_64.rpm
>>>>>>     http://packman.links2linux.org/download/calf/2956340/lv2-calf-0.0.60-4.7.x86_64.rpm
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     and, of course, liblilv-0-devel for Leap 42.3 (which this was
>>>>>>     working for you because the 2 examples did show up).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     You do not have to copy anything anywhere - they should just
>>>>>>     show up.  If further problems. let us know.  GG/Phyllis
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     On Mon, May 7, 2018 at 6:25 PM, Sam <cinelerra at posteo.de
>>>>>>     <mailto:cinelerra at posteo.de>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>         The Calf Plugin are unfortunately not displayed. Maybe
>>>>>>         I'm doing something wrong. Only two LV2 plugins are
>>>>>>         displayed, L2_Example Fifths and L2_Example Parameters.
>>>>>>         They seem to be dummy plugins.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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