[CinCV TNG] Cinelerra Merging from 4.0 - testing report

Rebecca ⠀ beccatoria at hotmail.com
Thu Apr 2 10:12:19 CEST 2015

Ah - excellent point.  On further inspection while most of the behaviour is new, this is not true of all the effects.  While I have memories of them working at some point, it seems they stopped working at some point prior to the merge with 4.0.  These aren't effects I use frequently so unfortunately I really don't know when they were working - it could have been years ago.  :(  Sorry!  
But!  To recap what IS changed behaviour due to the 4.0 merge:  
Points 1 (fade histogram), 4 (mask keyframes) and 5 (bezier curves) are CHANGED behaviour since the merge, and look like bugs.  
Points 2 (icons on the effects bar) and 6 (rendering) are CHANGED behaviour but not bugs.  Just stuff that's different.  
Point 3 (effects) I need to amend.  The TITLE effect is broken (the colours now don't work correctly).  This is CHANGED behaviour after the merge, this is a bug.  
The other effects I mentioned, while broken, are also broken in the main branch.  I do not believe this was the case for Oil Painting, Motion Blur or Wave in the past but as noted, I have no idea when they ceased working.  Experiments in the main branch with TimeFront yielded slightly different behaviour so I think there may be some change after the merge?  But honestly it's almost unusable so it's hard to be sure.  Time Average and Selective Temporal Averaging remain so hard to use I can't tell if there's a change in behaviour or not.  
Translate, as noted previously, has changed behaviour not due to the merge and discussion about the correct behaviour is something that's ongoing?  
Again, apologies for not double checking the effects against the main branch!  

Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 19:25:35 -0400
From: feranick at hotmail.com
To: cinelerra at lists.cinelerra-cv.org
Subject: Re: [CinCV TNG] Cinelerra Merging from 4.0 - testing report

Just to make sure... Are those behaviors limited to he merged version or (when it applies) something that happens also on the stable?

On Apr 1, 2015 6:21 PM, Rebecca ⠀ <beccatoria at hotmail.com> wrote:

Hey guys!  

I have also been testing the cinelerra-beta branch!  

It is generally good news - most features work well.  Here are the things I have discovered that are causing issues: 

1) Fade histogram not working correctly.  Fading out works fine.  Fading back in sometimes results in an issue where there is no interpolation.  It immediately brings the entire track in at 100% rather than fading in as it should.  This only seems to happen
 when creating a fade from 0% to 100%.  For instance, if I were fading in from 0% to 95%, it would work fine.  Also when testing to see if it was reproducible, a few times it didn't occur.  The most reliable way to reproduce (this ALWAYS resulted in the bug
 for me) was the following:  

Create two keyframes at 100% opacity (i.e. completely visible and not at all transparent).  Create a third keyframe between these two.  Pull that down to 0% opacity.  Playback should then fade out correctly, but snap immediately to full opacity after the middle
 keyframe rather than fading back in.  

Can anyone else confirm this behaviour?  

2) NOT a bug, just a change of behaviour due to the merge.  When an effect is added, the "on/off" button and the magnifying glass that allows access to effect parameters shift along the track to remain visible as you scroll.  However this also means that effects
 that only take up a small amount of track no longer have these icons visible.  I think this way always the case (even in CV) but the length the effect needs to be for the icons to show up is noticeably longer now. 

It's not really a big issue as the "on/off" and "show" options can be accessed by right-clicking.  Personally I'm fine with leaving it and don't think it represents a huge interface issue.  But I thought it might be worth noting in case others disagree. 

3) I tested most of the video effects.  There are a few that I'm really not sure how to test - C41 for instance, I'm not sure what it's meant to do or how I'd check it was working?  Others I don't really understand but can at least test to make sure
 they're doing SOMETHING and not crashing the programme (Find Object for instance).  I found a few effects that I think are now broken.  Some may have been broken in CV.  Some definitely weren't: 

- Motion blur - doesn't seem to do anything.  

- Oil Painting - doesn't seem to be working either.  

- Selective Temporal Averaging - may or may not be working but grinds the system to an ususeable halt.  Either have to kill Cinelerra in the terminal or actually reboot the computer it's so delayed in terms of response. 

- Time Average - as Selective Temporal Averaging.  Not quite as bad - once actually got the effects dialogue open, but it's...basically unuseable.  My computer is an i5, 2.3ghz, 4 gigs of ram.  So it's not a beast by any means, but I don't think it should
 be struggling this much with these effects.  

- Time Front - as the previous two time-related ones, it is ridiculously slow and caused Cinelerra to crash at least once.  But I did manage to mess around with it and it did seem to be doing...something. This is what makes me suspect the previous two
 effects may also have been working, just ALSO locking up my computer so much I couldn't test them.  It also seemed to be producing total garbage imagery, but I THINK this effect might be designed to work over a huge length of time and that could be the reason
 for it not working so well during testing?  

- Translate - change in behaviour I think I saw discussed on the list already?  Basically just that the In/Out X/Y parameters now squash rather than move the image.  But I think there's uncertainty as to whether this is a bug or intended behaviour? 

- Title - the colour is now messed up.  Only white, yellow, cyan and magenta work from the colour wheel.  It will show the colour you selected in the effects dialogue box, but on the actual track, you'll be stuck with one of those four. 

- Wave - messed up - the wave is squashed up against the far left side of the image. 

4) Mask keyframes - as also noted by others.  Interpolation of value and feathering has been fixed (YAYYYY!).  I do not believe that interpolation of mode is possible - it's a binary state.  However, a keyframe
image will only appear on the track if a mask point is moved.  If only the feathering or value is changed, then a keyframe
is created (because interpolation up to that point works), but the little green icon we know and love fails to appear.  If you select an earlier point and press play and let it play over the place where the keyframe
should be, the keyframe image suddenly appears.  

5) Bezier curves.  These are mostly working fine, and we are still using the style of bezier curve introduced in Cinelerra CV rather than HV.  I will admit I do not work much with this feature so I don't know if this is a problem that existed previously.  However,
 I will note that currently, if you right click a histogram keyframe and choose "tangent edit" it will either crash the programme or default to "disjoint edit" instead.  Repeatedly attempting to choose "tangent edit" will eventually crash the programme. 

6) This isn't really a problem, but might be worth noting.  I've never been able to get Cinelerra to render directly to .dv (and still can't) so I tend to render to .mov or .avi.  I had to significantly increase the bitrate of the render to get the same level
 of quality.  However this didn't affect the ultimate file size - once I increased the bitrate I got a file size about the same as I did before the merge.  I was always surprised at the quality level I got from a fairly low bit rate in the original CV so I'm
 thinking something probably got fixed here rather than broken.  But I mention it in case anyone else is in the same situation.

That's it for problems.  

I'd note that the ability to save presets for effects (a feature from 4.0) is working well.  As is the ability to jump to the next/previous edit.  I'm not aware of any other new features in 4.0 I should have been looking out for. 

Also, a few of the effects that previously refused to work for me (Find Object and Motion Tracking) now work.  So that's great! 

I tested importing, all basic editing functions (cutting, pasting, inserting, pasting silence, muting, pasting keyframes, etc.), moving tracks around, deleting tracks, all histogram functions (camera, projector, etc.), colour picker, masks, nearly all the video
 effects (see above for caveats), overlay modes, and all transitions.  

I tested rendering to a limited degree (because I've always had limited rendering options in Cinelerra, I essentially just tested that the options I usually use still work). 

I did not test audio effects as I don't use them much and need to stop for the night now. 

Great job, guys!  It's really nice to see this work being done.  I hope this is useful testing information.

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